Sammy Farha vs Jamie Gold
Watch part one of the above episode of High Stakes Poker if you have not yet seen it to see the pre flop action of this amazing hand between Jamie Gold and Sammy Farha. The preflop action is very important in this hand so make sure you watch it if you haven't seen it yet.
On my initial viewing of this hand I was sure that Farha let Gold off with the final bet as an act of charity in essence, out of the goodness of his heart. I watched the hand again to see if this was correct and I'm now convinced that Jamie's talk actually confused and put doubt into Sammy's head towards the end of the hand.
Before 4.10 in the timeline of the above video Sammy is convinced that Jamie has KK or QQ and is definitely going to bet the river. At around 4.10 or thereabouts Jamie says very convincingly that he has the best hand and that he is basically trying to save Sammy money. I think this is the point at which Sammy became very confused and doubtful over whether he definitely had the best hand and made the huge error of not betting the river.
What do you guys think? Kindness or Fear?
posted by TillerMaN | 9:09 AM
31 Comments:
Tiller i think that was just pure kindness from farha. I'm pretty sure he put jamie on some sort of a high PP (QQ-KK) and farha was never worried the whole hand. I dont see how he would be too concerned about jamie having a ten after the 2nd one showed up.
Farha seemed really relax and i think he knew jamie missed completely.
mustve been kindness coz I can't see Sammy of all people being scared to make a bet.
Maybe the only thing that confused Sammy is how Jamie kept saying "I call" and Sammy was thinking WTF going on here surely he wouldnt call with KK
I def think this was a total angle shoot from Gold tryin to save Farha from bettin the river as he was near sure he had AA and i really do think it was just good heart from Farha checkin on the end.
I notice Gold didt soft play against Farha when had the straight draw he really is a scum bag and out of his depth in that level with those players.
I love the way he can predict peoples hole cards when they turn them over lmao
If Gold knew himself a little better, he would be a genius. Should have all-in bluffed the pairing river card. Farha was owned.
IMO this has nothing to do with softplay or kindness.
Gold managed to work a mind-job on Farha (similar tactics that helped him win WSOP) - Greenstein even congratulates him at the end of the hand "you just saved $185,000" which anyone else would have lost.
Doyle comments that he would have lost the 185k there, the commentators both see it that way too.
Gold talks at him almost non stop from the middle of the hand, pressuring him & telling Farha repeatedly that he puts him on AA - then on the river "I'm calling no matter what you do" - it's possible Farha lost confidence that his AA was winning and under the pressure of the cameras & being verbally assaulted by Gold got confused enough to check thinking that Jamie was actually trying to trick him into betting.
The pressure may have stopped him from being able to think through the hand logically enough to see it clearly & they are probably playing too high for comfort.
fahra = donkey
Great Odin's Raven! I've never seen anything like that. Who knows what Sammy was going through. When Jamie was saying "I call" 32 times on the river whilst Farha counted his chips...urgh! That was just cringe worthy. If I was sat at that table I'd order a quadruple whiskey.
No way---Sammy is a shark---who got to show that he can be a Guppy-with Gold's banter--That was worthy of the Cartoon Network, allt hat table talk, b ut Jamie got off cheap---totally running interferance on Sammy.
I think sammy absolutely thought gold might have the best hand by the end.
As you say preflop is key. Both players know the other is capable of crazy plays, raising/calling very light. Key point here for sammy is that gold is perfectly capable of playing TT/99/even AT the same way, and on one level these hands are actually a bit more likely given the preflop action.
Once they've decided to play the flop dark there's just no way gold is folding to sammy's three bet without at least seeing the flop. As I interpreted it, it didn't seem an option for jamie to see the flop and then decide whether he calls the additional $60k sammy re-raised in the dark. and i think sammy knows gold is capable of the original $30k check-raise with a far larger range than KK/QQ because obviously he's a huge donk , but also because of sammy's lagtard image. By the end I think sammy is genuinely confused.
The most amazing thing is that jamie gold treats hsp, and playing with sammy specifically, like it's a friendly home game where they're not really out to do each other harm. Sammy of course doesn't feel that way at all and has been manipulating him all season.
I think sammy absolutely thought gold might have the best hand by the end.
As you say preflop is key. Both players know the other is capable of crazy plays, raising/calling very light. Key point here for sammy is that gold is perfectly capable of playing TT/99/even AT the same way, and on one level these hands are actually a bit more likely given the preflop action.
Once they've decided to play the flop dark there's just no way gold is folding to sammy's three bet without at least seeing the flop. As I interpreted it, it didn't seem an option for jamie to see the flop and then decide whether he calls the additional $60k sammy re-raised in the dark. and i think sammy knows gold is capable of the original $30k check-raise with a far larger range than KK/QQ because obviously he's a huge donk , but also because of sammy's lagtard image. By the end I think sammy is genuinely confused.
The most amazing thing is that jamie gold treats hsp, and playing with sammy specifically, like it's a friendly home game where they're not really out to do each other harm. Sammy of course doesn't feel that way at all and has been manipulating him all season.
There is no such thing as charity when you play high stakes cmon!
Jamie played it just fucking blrillanty, and even continued to confused farah after the hand is over. And you can also tell Sammy is pretty pissed imho :)
Gold: "I was really thinking I was doing you a favor"
Sammy: "I am not upset!"
Just lol... After Jamie clearly red the aces, how can you beleive that? THey both lying all the way ;p
I dont know, maybe I m just a donk, but to me it s clear as water from the first time I look at it (didnt read your comments before either...). To me Jamie crushed farah and farah is pissed ;)
Ahaha, the key point is that Jaime would bet (possibly push) on the river if he could beat aces, and would also do the same if he wanted to bluff. His hands fell within a certain range of hands (overpairs) when he checked the river. Why would he check (first to act) after hitting a second Ten, or if he had a full house. If Jaime could beat AA he'd bet on the river. He'd also bet on the river with a bluff. All Jaime was doing was was using his talk to try and save money.
Sammy wasn't being generous. Sammy should know Jaime well enough to recognize that in a pot with over 300k on the river where the board pairs, Jaime would bet with a T. Jaime (with a Ten) could put sammy all in, and sammy would have to make a heroic fold (~500k:~180k) here to avoid losing money. Sammy was thrown off of logical thinking and put into a position of confusion. No-one gives up 180k out of charity.
Actually, the proof is on the last hand... Sammy completly pissed to tie with the donk on the second run ;p
Haha I bet Sammy is setting up an Headsup game with Jamie as he did with Brian Townsend and there take the rest of his Money.
I think Sammy might be convinced that Jamie really put Sammy on AA for real especially if he still bets the river after Jamie saying 32 times i call.
So if Sammy thinks Jamie is 100% sure Sammy has AA, theres no sense in betting because he wont call then. Despite saying it 32 times before the bet.
No way it was kindness even though farha tries to play it off that way later.
Gold is a nutcase and all his talking got to Farha. Jamie really got him to believe that there was a chance he was behind and that is why he checked.
I think Farha was confused to hell on the river and missed what should have been an easy river bet. He only had about a half pot bet left on the river so there was no way he should have worried about a fullhouse or trip tens. Gold basically told him he had AA or KK with that stupid betting blind nonsense.
He then let Gold get inside his head and let it affect his judgement. Just like all those players in the WSOP.
On an aside, Gold is a total mug who is going to lose all his money if he keeps playing with these players.
MrSpeed
PS. Where DOES farha get all his $$$?
Against Ian's recommendation I watched the 2nd part first and thought that Jamie had talked enough fear into Sammy by the river. However, I then watched the first part and saw how the action went preflop and I think Sammy let him off. I really do.
I mean think about it - the only hand that Jamie realistically might play this way (preflop) would be the 1010 and that means there is only one combination that beats Sammy (the quads). I just don't see Jamie playing the flop blind with the PP's that would hit a set on this board.
I wouldn't hesitate to value shove this river putting my man squarely on KK or maybe QQ irrespective of his babbling.
I think Sammy in general just lacks confidence against "non-top-noch" players...
"Go home and bring Daniel" ;)
Great moment seeing that hand though, thanks for sharing Tiller. I was really shocked! :)
Kindness, I think Farha knows Gold is gonna do every penny in the big games to the pro's anyway and doesnt want to get on the wrong side of Jamie so let him off. Jamie's begging for it to be checked down was pathetic though.
Boba Fett
I do not think this was kindness, Farha wasn't sure he had the best hand and Jamie was convincing when he said he would call any raise. it was a bad (but understandable) move by Farha. The river T had actually helped him.
Funny thing is if Jamie had the best hand, it would have been either trips or a full house (AT or a flopped set), and he would have bet or checkraised the river, he wouldn't have said "I will CALL you no matter what". So it is actually a tell, especially from a couch at home.
i'm not sure but i sensed something weird between the two that firstly led me to believe the hand was all hollywood.. anyone ever had the same feeling?
also the lack of commentary from aj and kaplan.. i mean this is KK vs AA..
i'm not a good poker player(yet:p) but i'm extremely good at reading ppl..i do get a bit paranoid sometimes when i'm tired but i very rarely mistaken..
imho, Wyap has definetly got a good theory even if not likely at all...
Prepared hollywood hand for TV is at least possible... A poker player (or anybody) giving 180K on charity is not. (on a table that is...)
he can give it back anytime what's the big deal.. i just sensed something funny between the two.. i don't know if it was a 'sincerity glitch', case in which my reading skills are getting even better or either it was hollywood, case in which my paranoia skills are getting even better
I watched it too and I think it is a mix. Farha is not shy of losing big, but he is not dumb. He knows that when Gold plays big pots he don't necessarily have great cards. The preflop action would point towards QQ or KK for anyone else than Gold.
So yeah, I think Sammy plays it well against Gold. He is the only player at the table who could have three of a kind in that situation. Oh, Sammy could too.. but you get th epoint.
Of course it was kindness, they really like each other :) Sammy teaches him Omaha btw.
pure kindness
i would let Gold pay for it! :)
Definately fear, clear as day IMO. Sammy likes money, jamie wouldnt shut up so confused him. Juts look at his reaction l8r to losing to him.
A modicum of kindness and large helping of bewilderment.
Whether it was fear or kindenss on farha's part the whole hand pissed me off. Gold is a complete an utter cock!
Well, after seeing the bentamine / Laliberte hand in ep 15, I guess you can say Charity exists in poker... Sure it comes from Laliberte to whom money means not much prolly...
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